[Buildbot-devel] GSoC: provide forward compatibility for Python 3
Jørn Lomax
northlomax at gmail.com
Wed Apr 1 07:13:21 UTC 2015
On 30.03.2015 18:19, Pierre Tardy wrote:
> Another point is that pb does not have a bright future in buildbot. It
> is used for slave/master communication. We have a plan to switch to
> something more modern for slave/master communication. I have a Poc
> using wamp and crossbar.io <http://crossbar.io>, we could easily adapt
> PoC that to amqp, or amp.
>
If this is the case, then why not make this a part of GSoC? If buildbot
can be ported to use crossbar.io/AutoBahn which is python3 compatible, I
think that would be a better solution than spending time on twisted if
it's going to be dropped in the future anyway.
> So for the py3k work I think we can just drop the pb part our of the
> problem. There are plenty of work apart from that.
>
> I would estimate that py3k support for twisted's pb is a full GSoC by
> itself. So this might also be a solution to share work between you guys.
>
> There are currently four py3k proposals this year, several of them
> looks good for me, but there will be only one person of the projet,
> this is a clear rule from Google.
>
> The only way we can take several student on py3k is to split the
> project into clearly separated subprojects (also, provided we have
> enough mentors, and funds from Google)
>
> I would suggest for the students to take the opportunity of this
> thread to agree on who does what
>
Do you think you will get enough slots for this? I don't mean to sound
negative to the idea (I'm not), but I would imagine it would be better
to use the slots you get for other project ideas as well, and not just
py3 porting.
> Regards,
> Pierre
>
> Le lun. 30 mars 2015 à 08:46, Jørn Lomax <northlomax at gmail.com
> <mailto:northlomax at gmail.com>> a écrit :
>
> On 30.03.2015 06:16, Vasily Kuz'min wrote:
> > In my opinion, at first it is necessary to complete 40% of the
> > Twisted, and only then to start the main objective. On an evaluation
> > of alternative options some time will be required
> >
> I think it would be more important to look at the parts of twisted
> that
> buildbot relies the most on, which is the Prerspective Broker proker
> (pb). There are some parts of twisted buildbot never uses, so I don't
> think it should be within the scope of the project to port *all* of
> twisted. I think that would be an entire twisted GSoC project in
> itself.
>
> Unfortunately, pb is not a part of twisted I have much experience with
> so it's hard to say how hard it would be to port it to python3.
> Looking
> briefly at the source code it looks achvievable to do as part of the
> project, but maybe someone with more experience with the pb module
> have
> a better idea exactly how much work it would take
>
> regards,
> Jørn Lomax
> > 2015-03-30 2:10 GMT+03:00 Bob Hood <bhood2 at comcast.net
> <mailto:bhood2 at comcast.net>>:
> >> On 3/29/2015 3:29 PM, Vasily Kuz'min wrote:
> >>> Hi Dustin,
> >>>
> >>> thank you for your reply. I've uploaded my proposal as PDF to
> my server[0]
> >>> so that people who want could have a look. I've also attached
> it as text
> >>> file.
> >>>
> >>> I'm quite unsure about the timeline part, since I have to better
> >>> understand the
> >>> structure of the source code before I can give my time
> estimation. I think
> >>> I'll
> >>> have to correct it once I'll understand source code structure.
> >>>
> >>> As for Twisted, it seems that they mention several issues on the
> >>> corresponding
> >>> web page[0]. I doubt that's all that we should care about:
> milestone for
> >>> Py3K
> >>> shows that Twisted is only 60% ready[2]. I think it means that
> we may face
> >>> other problems except those listed. I don't think that will be
> a real
> >>> problem
> >>> though; moreover, I tend to think that means I can help both
> buildbot and
> >>> Twisted.
> >>>
> >>> Generally speaking, we have two ways: create various
> work-arounds for
> >>> buildbot
> >>> or correct these issues in Twisted directly. The first is
> faster but I
> >>> think
> >>> it is incorrect, because it'll introduce backward
> incompatibilities later
> >>> when
> >>> Twisted will get updated its APIs. What I really think about is to
> >>> collaborate
> >>> with Twisted guys. I tend to think that the second way is
> better, but of
> >>> course
> >>> we shall concentrate on things related to buildbot. However,
> I'd like to
> >>> know
> >>> your opinions.
> >>>
> >>> [0] http://derzsky.freedom-web.ru/proposal.pdf
> >>> [1]
> https://twistedmatrix.com/documents/14.0.0/core/howto/python3.html
> >>> [2] https://twistedmatrix.com/trac/milestone/Python-3.x
> >>
> >> Hello, Vasily! Thanks for your proposal.
> >>
> >> I'm a bit concerned about the Twisted framework. Being 60% done
> means it's
> >> 40% incomplete, and that is a large risk to your success. As
> you've pointed
> >> out, working on Twisted yourself is certainly one option, but
> that then
> >> takes time away from your focus on Buildbot. A completed
> Twisted framework
> >> for Python 3.0 is a dependency to successfully completing your
> proposal, and
> >> on that page you provide, it actually says "No date set" for
> completion.
> >>
> >> In light of all this (which would be setting off alarms and Big
> Red Flags to
> >> a project manager), have you given any thought to
> alternatives? I recall
> >> reading about 'asyncio' being a viable alterntive to Twisted in
> Python v3.
> >> Do you think it would be wise to have a "plan b" available in
> case Twisted
> >> is not fully ported to Python v3 by the time your project needs
> to complete?
> >> I'm not saying Dustin would accept that ( ;) ), but it would show
> >> recognition of that dependency and its risk to successful
> completion.
> >>
> >> Also, the schedule you include in your proposal could probably
> benefit from
> >> some additional detail. Having a four-month block that only says
> >> "Reimplementing the core functionality" is quite nebulous and
> doesn't really
> >> offer anything from which a metric of task success can be
> measured. I
> >> understand that you are not really familiar with the Buildbot
> code base, but
> >> I'm sure there must be some higher-level tasks that could be
> listed with
> >> time estimates, e.g.: "Familiarize myself with Buildbot's
> design - 1 week";
> >> "Evaluate 'asyncio' as an alternative to the Twisted framework
> - 1 week";
> >> etc. There needs to be goals and milestones so the health of
> your progress
> >> on the task can be monitored.
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
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